Curse

Ollj · Sep 23, 2005, 06:26 AM // 06:26

Enery hour a Newbie dies in Thunderhead Keep.

Please spend some time to help theese poor kids, geting basic needs like infused armor (seen an uninfused monk killing the whole party in the end), basic equipment (seen a ranger with a fire wand) and monks that use comon sense.

"Monks for Thunderhead" helps noobs to come trough Thunderhead Keep serveral times a day, because they have unlocked everything and they know money and know rank are worthless and meaningless and even finding a decent group that can kill the simplest IWAY build takes iWAY too long.

Just listen to the all chat in Thunderhead Keep for 5 minutes to know THESE NOOBS NEED YOUR HELP!!! The Situation of Thunderhead Keep as a Noob trap has to stop, they pulled down each other long enough!
Just grab some "Paladins" and pull them out of this location to make it more noob free, everyone will thank you for this.
(And its damn challenging and funny most times)

"Owning Ollj" yesterdays groups, all succeded, ben a walk in the Park:

Eonwe · Sep 23, 2005, 06:28 AM // 06:28

Oh yay.... pve. Sounds like tons of fun!

One and Two · Sep 23, 2005, 06:36 AM // 06:36

wait...so what do you wnat?

Mumblyfish · Sep 23, 2005, 06:43 AM // 06:43

You could help more people by spamming Local with "Grab seven henchmen, stand next to Ironhammer". I can't say I approve of your suggestion, though. So you help the kind of person that can't get past Thunderhead Keep through PvE. When he's finished PvE, where's he going to go? PvP! Hooray, more Mending! Thanks, Ollj!

Tactical-Dillusions · Sep 23, 2005, 06:48 AM // 06:48

Anyone who gets stuck at THK for more than a week is either very unlucky, or very very poor by playing standards and deserves to be stomped on by boulder-bashing tundra giants until C2.

Helped my basketful of noobs through but the trauma makes it less worthwhile.

Lasareth · Sep 23, 2005, 06:50 AM // 06:50

There comes a point where it should click that the person is doing something wrong. I recently went with a person who was on their (I think) 10th run and he got mad because I wasn't targeting Demetrios while the others were coming for us.

I mean, really :| If people actually paid attention to what they should be doing then they'd get by a lot faster.

(and as a sidenote, targeting Mursaat bosses while others are coming for you is the worst thing you can do. You'll get swamped with adds and won't be able to overcome the heavy fire on you)

One and Two · Sep 23, 2005, 06:52 AM // 06:52

Remember, Thunderhead is a big frikkin newb filter. Im sorry, but thats what it is.

Why would i want to bring complete newbs to the ring of fire? the titan quests? no thanks...

Ashley Twig · Sep 23, 2005, 07:21 AM // 07:21

I think, the idea of "helping others", brought up by the OP is not meant like "make sure they keep alive", but actually to "teach" them some basic tactics.

On the other hand: if they haven't learned by the time they reach THK, it seems pretty hopeless.

Ollj · Sep 23, 2005, 07:46 AM // 07:46

problem is one person has the power to kill a whole team in there. happens a lot.
Im just compensating that one idiot most times, he keeops a lot of not so bad players in there.

And thunderhead keep fails as a noob filter, they are still in the tombs with IWAY without needing to solve this mission.

And "AI king babisitting missions" are damn hard because of the AI, too. Remember rurik from the second beta? this is pretty much the same.

And there IS a complete lack of monks.

One and Two · Sep 23, 2005, 07:49 AM // 07:49

tombs doesnt matter, cus you can be a first timer with a pvp character and no unlocks, going into tombs.

BunnyMaster · Sep 23, 2005, 08:07 AM // 08:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ashley Twig

actually to "teach" them some basic tactics.

/signed on teaching ppl basic skills. Some just got lucky and managed to reach THK with only 7 skills on the skillbar ("Skills? I thought that when I got lvl20 I would get the rest" <-- true story)

I agree there's a lack of monks because most ppl (yes Wa/Mo, you know who I mean) still don't get why I need resting time to regen my mana. Or that I can't heal my party which is scattered allover the map AND keep an eye on DwarfBoy. Funny thing is that I once jokingly asked for 2k if ppl wanted me in their party, I got numerous offers (Gold Items, 3k+ and even an Ecto - I reclined all and joined a Mesmer/Necro Group).

The person teaching them the basic skill would have to be a monk: Pay head to my lessons or be ready to die!

coolsti · Sep 23, 2005, 08:20 AM // 08:20

I am working up a Monk slowly as my 4th and last character, and I look forward to being in this (heh heh) quite controlling situation. Believe me, I will aid in the instructions of these players. Already as Elem/Mo where I take a lot of healing spells with me, I simply refuse to heal/resurrect the party members who SHOUT to be resurrected, berate the healers for not healing enough, or charge ahead without waiting for the support to be ready. (One got me so angry I told her she might as well leave the group cuz I wouldn't rez her. Darn, Alesia Henchy was in our group and was not so strict as I was, though).

I mean, after playing this game through with 4 characters, things do get a bit dull after a while. But then there is a whole new aspect of the game to explore, which may never get boring: dealing with poor players and trying to train them into better (both regarding tactics and team play) players.

FrogDevourer · Sep 23, 2005, 09:15 AM // 09:15

That's very charitable Ollj, but I think the best way to help newbies is not to not to powerlevel them through tough spots, it is to teach them the game basics, and how to beat missions/quest by themselves.

Like all missions, you can complete TK quite easily with henchmen. Yes, easily.

For TK, the trick is to stay out of the danger zone. As soon as the invasion starts, get the bonus, then stay *very* close to the king. Stay out of the aggro circle of incoming monsters. The invading monsters will kill one another, and you just have to kill the few groups that weren't intercepted by other monsters, and the final group of white mantles (who can be killed quite easily). It's a very easy way to complete the mission (almost looks like a bug since mursaat and white mantles fight one another). However, it's very long and very boring since you don't actually fight anything.

Aera Lure · Sep 23, 2005, 12:42 PM // 12:42

Idealist I am, I still have to say a cheer for Ollj. I find that sort of good will to be a bit few and far between in this game quite honestly. If it helps some players, its a great thing.

Ollj · Sep 23, 2005, 01:32 PM // 13:32

FrogDevourer that doestn work and that doesnt help the game at all.

Arton · Sep 23, 2005, 01:41 PM // 13:41

That is a nice thought and some of these people should be helped. Then there is the other group that should never get past Thunderhead. You know the ones when you are the healing monk and ping your energy bar for a rest. This person keeps charging on so you say "Wait a sec for my energy to recharge". They usually reply with something like "Keep up and shut up noob".

Those people deserve to be stuck at Thunderhead. This way we don't have to deal with them at Perdition Rock and farther.

Tijger · Sep 23, 2005, 02:04 PM // 14:04

I guided my gf (playing a w/r) and another friend of mine (w/mo) as a ranger thru T'head Keep, no human monks or other humans in the party.

We failed twice and made it through on the 3rd, the failures came because not everyone fully understood the mission on the first go and because they ignore a Mursaat monk on the 2nd. 3rd went smooth as silk.

I know the mission, sure, but I'm no great player with mad skillz, T'head Keep isnt that hard, it just requires staying together and focus.

kawaii_bat · Sep 23, 2005, 02:10 PM // 14:10

So how does this charity thing work?
We(two monks) get together and Thunderhead keep and holler:
''Will help teach ppl how to play/finnish missions properly and help them get through this mission'' ?

I'm all up for that!

But seriously how do we organise ourselves? Add each other to friend lists? Website/forum?

Yes: I agree thunderhead keep *is* a newb filter of some sort, but it doesn't help when a whole guild or more responsible friends finnish the mission for incompetent players who then get to the Ring of fire and destroy other ppl's fun. So it's better to do a preemptive strike and teach them those things instead of letting them succeed without learning anything.
------------------------------
Personnally I have never gotten a bad team in RoF, they where all pros of the 3 golden rules:

1-Stay together
2-

Read what other ppl write!

<==I can't stress this enough.
3-Rest &/or wait up for monks between battles.

These rules are unknown by a good 80% of population of 10-14 year old kids playing the game (and you can tell they are kids not teenages by their style of play).
-------------------------------------------

Ex of a 10 year old who's never learned playing basics:

Minooshka Katnikov casts Divine boon on Minooshka Katnikov.
Minooshka Katnikov is casting orison healing on Bob angryman.
Minooshka Katnikov: My energy is 22 of 43!
Minooshka Katnikov casts mend ailment on Bob angryman.
Minooshka Katnikov: My energy is 16 of 43!
Minooshka Katnikov casts orison healing on Bob angryman,
Minooshka Katnikov: My energy is 10 of 43!
Minooshka Katnikov casts reversal of fortunes on Bob angryman
Minooshka Katnikov: My energy is 4 of 43!
Bob Angryman is dead
Bob Angryman: Woah! Great healing you stupid Noob monk!
Minooshka Katnikov: Damned if you do Damned if you don't XP.

**Note this name is fictional but I have had a person do something similar **

You're pretty much screwed for everything you can possibly do with those ppl and it makes them that much more unpleasant to play with.

User Name · Sep 23, 2005, 02:32 PM // 14:32

this might be the worst idea ever. Thunderhead Keep is a noob trap for a reason...if they can't figure out how to get through it they shouldn't be infected the outposts past TK. All you're going to do is push them through to the next mission where they'll get stuck and turn that outpost into a noob trap..

FrogDevourer · Sep 23, 2005, 02:57 PM // 14:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ollj

FrogDevourer that doestn work and that doesnt help the game at all.

Sometimes it does, sometimes it doesn't.

I've played with "pick up players" that didn't know how to focus fire, nor to pull monsters properly. After a couple of missions, I was happy to see they knew how to use their radar properly and to play as a group. I'm not a good teacher but when you no longer heal someone, he tends to listen to what you're preaching.

When the group doesn't want to improve nor to listen, well... it can still retry the same mission over and over. I think TK is a good choke point to learn PvE basics.